Again I die...

[Socratatus]

ryzen is crap. get core i5 and be fine

I was on a core i5 which was good, went to Ryzen. It was much much better. please don`t spread misinformation. Also you don`t even specify what kind of i5`s either. Guess you just want to look `edgy`.

[greypanther]

Someone said similar regarding Ryzen, I seem to remember in the similar thread I started in the Off Topic section, however the 44 answers in the Ryzen performance thread, here in this section, would put me off buying one...
Just saying like.

[Methexonion]

Just my poorly informed opinion guys.

I was asked to help on a PC upgrade of a friend and I transferred the question to a trusty and with no bias forum that deals with PC technology. I got responses from 5 members.... they all said that the latest AMD platform is the way to go these days (and for the near future).

It seems that the Intel chips have higher clock speeds at a single core, BUT the Ryzen offer similar speeds on all 8 cores (we were talking about the comparison between I7-8500K against the Ryzen 2700X) which in practice means that you'll be able to do anything else you can think of while you have any game running... streaming, photoshoping, compress/decompress archives, hell even watch a movie at the same time. Also there are plenty games (and more are coming) that make use of multiple cores.

These chips are monsters and also they are cheaper AND they come with a fine cooler on top. I checked on youtube comparisons and noone said anything different.

I cannot think of ANY reason to go with Intel this time (I'm planning an upgrade myself in a couple of months), they are just been left behind. Both companies have plans for newer chips next year, AMD guarantied that they'll be a backwards compatibility (no new mobo) already.

P.S. I had always an Intel PC

[KextV8]

Ryzen probably best bang for the buck if you're on a budget. I vote with what everyone else has been saying.

[Socratatus]

Just my poorly informed opinion guys.

I was asked to help on a PC upgrade of a friend and I transferred the question to a trusty and with no bias forum that deals with PC technology. I got responses from 5 members.... they all said that the latest AMD platform is the way to go these days (and for the near future).

It seems that the Intel chips have higher clock speeds at a single core, BUT the Ryzen offer similar speeds on all 8 cores (we were talking about the comparison between I7-8500K against the Ryzen 2700X) which in practice means that you'll be able to do anything else you can think of while you have any game running... streaming, photoshoping, compress/decompress archives, hell even watch a movie at the same time. Also there are plenty games (and more are coming) that make use of multiple cores.

These chips are monsters and also they are cheaper AND they come with a fine cooler on top. I checked on youtube comparisons and noone said anything different.

I cannot think of ANY reason to go with Intel this time (I'm planning an upgrade myself in a couple of months), they are just been left behind. Both companies have plans for newer chips next year, AMD guarantied that they'll be a backwards compatibility (no new mobo) already.

P.S. I had always an Intel PC

I work at home. Often I`ll work whie playing this game, or watching a series. The Ryzen is perfect for this kind of thing when work gets a bit boring. The top end Intels are faster, but Ryzen is an allround execellent workhorse. Also cheaper last I looked.

[OwnlyMe]

i5 9600k = 250€
only question is whether you get an overclockable motherboard
ryzen is crap for games... maybe that will change with the next generation

windows costs 20€ max (oem), microsoft doesn't like it but you can usually activate it, at least via telephone.

but i don't know what psu i'd recommend... i had 2 - bequiet and evga - both pretty expensive and widely recommended but both made my gpu scream, and let my graphics card cause interference on my active speakers via usb and normal mobo audio...(happened with an asrock motherboard and asus rog motherboard) and the first psu even blew up in smoke.


i just wonder how you managed to screw your pc 2 times in a row... sounds very suspicious to me.

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

Last week my graphics card blew, so I bought a new one. Last night my PC blew up too

That sounds like a power supply failure. A bad PSU will fry a bunch of things in rapid succession without being the obvious culrpit. You need to get that tested and make sure it's not the cause, or you're going to bleed money.

[Gregorovitch]

You should easily be able to get the parts you need for £600 from this list.

https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/gaming-pc-build-guide/

[OwnlyMe]

You should easily be able to get the parts you need for £600 from this list.

https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/gaming-pc-build-guide/

they have obviously no idea about building a pc.
for example they recommend a non-k processor with a z370 motherboard
i wouldnt go save that 40€ on the cpu either. i have the 8400 and keep regretting it because it just turbos to 3.8 ghz while that 9600k boosts up to 4.6 ghz on all cores. with the current prices (220€ vs 260€) thats a no brainer.
you can get a cheap z370 motherboard to go along with it (bios update required) but double check if it works with the specific board.
edit: you won't be able to flash your bios on the most boards with the 9th gen cpu.. so better get a z390 board in the first place.

[Gregorovitch]

You should easily be able to get the parts you need for £600 from this list.

https://www.pcgamer.com/uk/gaming-pc-build-guide/

they have obviously no idea about building a pc.
for example they recommend a non-k processor with a z370 motherboard

Oh, I think they do:

The Gigabyte Z370P D3 is a mainstream motherboard that will deliver everything needed to run the i5-8400. The board is capable of overclocking, if you have a K-series chip, though if you're going that route you might want something geared more toward enthusiasts.

Not that there's anything wrong with the Z370P D3. It supports memory speeds up to DDR4-4000 and includes an M.2 slot for a fast SSD or Optane Memory. About the only thing missing is USB 3.1 Type-C support, and there's also no wi-fi or extra accouterments, so for example SLI isn't supported (though CrossFireX is).

If you're interested in those extras, there are tons of 300-series boards for Coffee Lake processors, including new Z390 options. But if you're after something better than this Gigabyte board, you're probably also looking at a higher-end build, which we cover in our best high-end PC.

In other words it's a decent MB for £91, and you can even OC your chip on it, but if wanted to do that kind of thing you'd probably want a better one.

[Methexonion]

This site might help you decide Intel/AMD ....

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/I ... 4030vs3958

[OwnlyMe]

This site might help you decide Intel/AMD ....

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/I ... 4030vs3958

there's not a single gaming benchmark...
there you go:
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/ryzen ... 38046.html

[OwnlyMe]

i think i got my recommendation list together now..:
i5-9600k = 248€
MSI Z390-A Pro = 123€ (if that fits into your tower... otherwise ASRock Z390M Pro4 i guess.)
windows = 20€
EVGA SuperNOVA 650 G3 = 92€ (i have the g2.. as i said i have buzzing on my usb sound card and coil whine in my graphics card, but that might just be because of my 1080, i was able to get rid of the buzzing on my usb sound card with a dual transformer and the coil whine is only under specific work loads.)
total = 463€

[Methexonion]

i think i got my recommendation list together now..:
i5-9600k = 248€
MSI Z390-A Pro = 123€ (if that fits into your tower... otherwise ASRock Z390M Pro4 i guess.)
windows = 20€
EVGA SuperNOVA 650 G3 = 92€ (i have the g2.. as i said i have buzzing on my usb sound card and coil whine in my graphics card, but that might just be because of my 1080, i was able to get rid of the buzzing on my usb sound card with a dual transformer and the coil whine is only under specific work loads.)
total = 463€

Complete it please with Ram and a cooler

[Kasrith]

For gaming purposes, Intel still outperforms AMD. Even at the i5-9600k level, which is actually cheaper in the US (by about $20.00) than the Ryzen 2700X, albeit without a cooler.

For multi-threaded applications the Ryzen will typically come out ahead provided you aren't overclocking your Intel chip, which after OC, the Intel chips will still come out on top (but at a significantly higher price point).

[OwnlyMe]

[...]

Complete it please with Ram and a cooler

for the cooler i have the Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO for 30€. its pretty huge and cools very good but i wouldn't throw my pc into my car to go on lan parties because the cooler is so heavy and im afraid it will break something on an uneven road^^
but it's not very easy to install.

ram:
stock speed = G.Skill RipJaws V DIMM Kit 16GB (2x8GB), DDR4-2400, CL15-15-15-35 = 100€
overclocked = G.Skill Aegis DIMM Kit 16GB (2x8GB), DDR4-3000, CL16-18-18-38 = 109€

Are you sure your ram is fried or don't you have any ddr 4 ram?
It's also unlikely that your cpu is broken.
And usually you can use your old windows 10 license, you just need to call there.

btw: wanna buy my i5-8400 for 185€ incl insured shipping ? i'd love to upgrade to an i5-9600k (im serious)

[Gavrushka]

Thanks, everyone, for their input. - I think I've decided to go for a brand new PC, and will just slot my existing graphics card into it: This one seemed decent. I'm paying a little more than I'd wanted, but it has received good reviews

Last week my graphics card blew, so I bought a new one. Last night my PC blew up too

That sounds like a power supply failure. A bad PSU will fry a bunch of things in rapid succession without being the obvious culprit. You need to get that tested and make sure it's not the cause, or you're going to bleed money.

Thank you, I had an old PC with servicable PSU, so followed your suggestion. It does look like you were right, and the old PSU had fried something or other. - The PC powered up with the new PSU, CPU fan came on, and power went to all areas, but the motherboard I guess cooked because keyboard and mouse didn't receive power, and the hard disk light didn't flash, nor was there any screen output. There were no warning beeps, so I accept that's game over. - But now I'm a little concerned. - The PC I'm getting has a 500watt PSU, and that's just what the dead one had. - The graphics card is a 1050GTI, so doesn't use much, and the I7 8700 uses only 65 watts, but I'm not as tech-savvy as once I was, so was wondering if there is some other power draw when playing games that's overstressing it.

[Morkonan]

... - But now I'm a little concerned. - The PC I'm getting has a 500watt PSU, and that's just what the dead one had. - The graphics card is a 1050GTI, so doesn't use much, and the I7 8700 uses only 65 watts, but I'm not as tech-savvy as once I was, so was wondering if there is some other power draw when playing games that's overstressing it.

The only way to know is to add everything up, using manufacturer's specs. Some sites let you do that easily using a drop-down/other stock picker menu in order to pick out an adequate PSU or they'll make recommendations for PSU.

IMO, just mine, 500 watts seems a bit low for a modern system. But, I have always been a "more power" sort of guy when it comes down to PSUs.

Here's a generic tool you can use: https://outervision.com/power-supply-calculator (Just grabbed one off a quick search, there are plenty of others)

Here's a manufacturer's tool if, for instance, you'd want to use CoolerMaster - http://www.coolermaster.com/power-supply-calculator/

[AdmiralTigerclaw]

Thanks, everyone, for their input. - I think I've decided to go for a brand new PC, and will just slot my existing graphics card into it: This one seemed decent. I'm paying a little more than I'd wanted, but it has received good reviews

Last week my graphics card blew, so I bought a new one. Last night my PC blew up too

That sounds like a power supply failure. A bad PSU will fry a bunch of things in rapid succession without being the obvious culprit. You need to get that tested and make sure it's not the cause, or you're going to bleed money.

Thank you, I had an old PC with servicable PSU, so followed your suggestion. It does look like you were right, and the old PSU had fried something or other. - The PC powered up with the new PSU, CPU fan came on, and power went to all areas, but the motherboard I guess cooked because keyboard and mouse didn't receive power, and the hard disk light didn't flash, nor was there any screen output. There were no warning beeps, so I accept that's game over. - But now I'm a little concerned. - The PC I'm getting has a 500watt PSU, and that's just what the dead one had. - The graphics card is a 1050GTI, so doesn't use much, and the I7 8700 uses only 65 watts, but I'm not as tech-savvy as once I was, so was wondering if there is some other power draw when playing games that's overstressing it.

Most toaster word processor bricks run on 450 watt PSUs. 500 watts is what I would call 'barely running anything' levels of power. You want to run something like a graphics card on a gaming performance machine? You want to ensure you have 800 or more watts PSU, essentially double the capacity of your basic word brick PSU.

Typically, go for around a 1,000 watt PSU. And there's a reason for that.

Even if you don't use all the capability of a PSU, the closer you are to maximum PSU performance, the less efficient and hotter it runs. The hotter it runs, the shorter its lifespan. And here's why:

One - The capacitors in the heart of the PSU are electrolytic caps. They look like C or D cell batteries (but aren't). Capacitors perform the second stage of electrical signal conditioning from AC into DC after the diode bridge. They take the pulsing DC waveform and smooth it down so that it's less a pulse, and more a ripple. If the capacitors fail, then they don't smooth out the pulses. Thus, instead of a DC ripple that only needs some minor final conditioning, you got essentially a stream of unwanted mini-surges coming out of the PSU into the sensitive 5 volt and 12 volt channels of your boards. The voltage surges mathematically become heat (V=IR ; P=IV), heat cooks small sensitive things faster than large things. The unwanted mini surges eventually whittle away at something and a card or board fails.

The key in the Capacitors for long functionality is understanding that they have something inside them called Electrolytic fluid. As a fluid, it is subject to something fluids like to do, evaporate. And of course, the hotter the fluid, the faster it evaporates. So the cooler you can run your PSU, the cooler the caps stay, and the longer they will last.


Two - The cooling fans for PSUs, especially cheap ones, are run with simple cheap DC motors. Unlike the ceiling fan in your house, which is a nearly unkillable AC motor (my ceiling fan has been running almost non-stop for nearly 15 years), the DC motors will often have physical contacts inside the motor that eventually wear out, much the same manner as the brakes on your car. Compounding this, as the contacts wear out, they produce a fine carbon dust that exacerbates the grinding, and can gum up the motor, causing it to jam when it gets bad enough. No motor, no PSU cooling fan, hot PSU. Hot PSU? Shorter cap lifespan. Shorter lifespan, micro-surges. Surges, heat. Heat, fried cards. Dead PC.

Please don't let the blue smoke out of the box, we need that for the electronics genie to do his work.

Either way, long and short of that means you want to have lots of overhead to keep the PSU from operating hot, because it'll last longer and run nicer.

Another thing to consider is also if the PSU has a built in surge protection mechanism. We're not talking the kind of surge protection you get from the 12 dollar wall strip you buy from the end cap at Wal-Mart. We're talking the ones you see being sold for $30 or more that advertise actual SURGE PROTECTION in joules of energy. I know Corsair PSUs come with, or came with built-in surge protection (my PSU is a corsair). I also use an UPS for its battery backup and surge protection ability, and that's on TOP of having a medium rating actual surge strip. So I have three (3) layers of surge protection going into my computer. That may seem like a bit much, but when you're investing hundreds to a few thousand in a PC that you want to last a decade, what's a few hundred bucks? As a personal anecdote, the house I'm in has been on the receiving end of not just lightning related surges, but surges from the power company doing things, and general irregularities comping off the grid itself. We've recently lost a dryer, and had an unknown short pop the breaker for the air-conditioner exterior tower unit. And many more strange electrical events. And the protection I put on my system has saved it where other equipment in this house has failed.

[OwnlyMe]

Thanks, everyone, for their input. - I think I've decided to go for a brand new PC, and will just slot my existing graphics card into it: This one seemed decent. I'm paying a little more than I'd wanted, but it has received good reviews

evaluating the i7-8700 is difficult, with a good board and good cooling it performs on the level of the 8700k which is 10% faster than the 9600k, but even the i7-8700 is 36% more expensive.
The HDD is basically useless for gaming, especially for open world games.

i don't really get why you want to pay 200L more for the same performance but thats your decision.
i'm out.